What is the difference between Modern Arnis and Tapi Tapi?

Discussion in 'Modern Arnis' started by Carol, Dec 29, 2006.

  1. Carol

    Carol <font color = blue><b>Technical Administrator</b><

    I see these two terms together a lot, but I'm not quite sure what the differences in style and lineage are.

    Can anyone explain further?
     
  2. Apollo

    Apollo Administrator

    tapi-tapi is a part of Modern Arnis. It's definition varies a bit between organizations from what I understand. It's basically a 2 person sparring drill involving single stick.
     
  3. Tarot

    Tarot New Member

    Tapi-Tapi means "counter for counter". It's a two person sparring drill using sticks. It can be done various ways:

    Each person has one stick
    Each person has two sticks
    One person has one stick and one person has two sticks

    There is right vs. right Tapi-Tapi meaning each person is holding their stick with their right hand. And there is left vs. right Tapi-Tapi with one person right handed and the other person left handed. The Professor thought it was very important (and rightly so!) that students learn how to use their left hand and be able to work a stick left handed.

    "Counter for counter" means when your partner makes a move, you block/check/counter that move. And then in turn your partner then blocks/checks and counters and the drill goes on. It's meant to teach the students how to excecute different strikes, blocks, and also locks. It also helps students understand "the flow", easily moving from one move to the next without having to stop and think. Tapi-tapi drills are great for helping students learn footwork and how important it is.

    It is always used in conjunction with Modern Arnis because the Professor taught it and vauled it.
     
  4. arnisador

    arnisador Active Member

    Yes, I agree! Tapi-tapi is an important Modern Arnis drill and concept--namely, that the one who can "counter the (opponent's) counter" will win the battle. It ultimately derives from Balintawak (Eskrima), one of the two FMAs that form the basis of Modern Arnis.

    The most common form of practice has two partners facing one another, each with a single stick and often L on R, striking in a set sinawali-like pattern and periodically breaking into a multi-move bait-and-lock maneuver.
     
  5. monkey

    monkey -== Banned ==-

    tapi tapi!!!

    As far As I was told on one of the Dialects!
    CONTRA POR CONTRA ment counter for counter!
    I will look into the actaul words in differant dialects to see if it may have other meanings!
    Like in the U>S> Sayibg the word to you dont know if is said too-two-to-tu(Untile it is linked with a definition!)
    The meaning might not be justified for the means!Like dumogaton!
    This means cattle wrestleing!1980'S Inosanto coined the phrase dumog!
    It stuck in alot of arts!
     
  6. oosh

    oosh Junior Member

    "1980'S Inosanto coined the phrase dumog"

    Unlikely, I believe the term comes from the Illongo dialect (not 100 % sure) - either way Guro Inosanto didn't invent the term, perhaps you're thinking of "Panantukan" ?
     
  7. monkey

    monkey -== Banned ==-

    coin!!

    Coin dose not mean to invent nor will it ever!
    it simply means on a loose term way he used it!
    Inosanto is an invaluable walking life testiment to the arts!
    He has been exspesed to 100's of styles & or systems!
    So for that small phrase to be used is not to say he invented it!
    He used it & others seem to follow alot of what he dose & or says!
    Much like Vunak & H-K-E!Head butts Kness & Elbows!
    Vunak has his Street serries & the seal tapes & others!
    most of his followers coin & or use the same terms!
    It dose not mean they invented the terms Vunak used!
    It means they used it!
     
  8. oosh

    oosh Junior Member

    Yeh my bad, not "invent" instead coin should refer to "A new word or new meaning for an existing word" that would be neologism- so in this instance it is difficult to say 1. Dumog isn't a new word 2. Dumog should still refer to Dumog....so the only way your wording can be correct is if you are saying Guro Inosanto's dumog refers to something different to what it is in PI ?

    "Coin 9.to make; invent; fabricate: to coin an expression." http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/coin

    "1. make up; "coin phrases or words"

    "To devise (a new word or phrase)."

    Also here's another tip, write a sentence then press "fullstop" then press "space" and start again...continue this process.
     
    Last edited: Jan 1, 2007
  9. arnisador

    arnisador Active Member

    I think to "coin a phrase" means to put that phrase together, and to "coin a word" means to invent it:

    I don't know who, if anyone, coined the word dumog. I've heard it both ways--invented (or re-assigned a new meaning) in the U.S., and an old word in the Phil.
     
  10. monkey

    monkey -== Banned ==-

    Dumog!!

    YOU KNOW--MAYBE SOME DAY SOME WERE SOME HOW!
    Somew one will come out with a BOOK on all the terms ect on this subject-history ect!
    That would be way cool!
     
  11. arnisador

    arnisador Active Member

    I would love to have an authoritative book on this! Some U. of Phil. linguist could surely do it if he or she took an interest in the Filipino martial arts.
     
  12. monkey

    monkey -== Banned ==-

    dumog

    I Think it would be a great asset to not only the seasond fighters but also the new commers!
    Historicaly the art would be layed down & have a great back round !
    But I see 1 small problem!
    Would it be like an accual book --is there enough info or would it be like a magazine?
     
  13. oosh

    oosh Junior Member

    "I think to "coin a phrase" means to put that phrase together, and to "coin a word" means to invent it:"


    The link I posted makes no distinction -

    American Heritage Dictionary - To devise (a new word or phrase).

    Ultimately I'm being pedantic, but the point I'm really trying to make is on Monkey's vague and misleading use of language. Personally I'd rather say Guro Inosanto propogated the term in the 1980s. It is petty, but comments like Monkey's are the reason we have so many troubles and misunderstandings with the history of our art.
     
  14. monkey

    monkey -== Banned ==-

    coin a phrase!

    Yes it dose mean to invent as I looked it up!
    I was quoting a freind on what he said to me back in
    90 so I will be carefull on the terms!
    Let me be so kind to re state it them!
    Inosanto lightly used the term--not as invention
    but as example to refure to a reference point of contact
    & what would be shown!
    Let me re-state it like say
    side kick!Do you know which of the 15 side kicks
    I am talking of with out a point of referance!
    Some kind of example or demo has to be used!
    Some say twist kick-some say inverted kick!
    Some will never follow the Y axis & then the X axis to make the twist kick!
     
  15. Aimjiel

    Aimjiel New Member

    What is Tapi-Tapi

    Hi All

    I thought I would tackle a longer explanation of Tapi Tapi, which I understand as being a part of the concept that Modern Arnis calls Visadario, the root of which may come from the verb to target, meaning the tome, or collection of targeting techniques.

    Tapi Tapi is the stick trapping aspect, as opposed to strikes and disarms, stick trapping can be seen as an intermediate step to a disarm or strike, or it can be seen as an end to itself. There is of course R-R, L-R, and L-L Tapi-Tapi with applications with empty hand against weapon, or weapon against weapon. Everything from canes, to swords and even the Dulo-Dulo. While Tapi Tapi is a wide and profound aspect of Modern Arnis, I wouldn't say it is an art unto itself, well not entirely. I highly recommend the founder's video on Visadario for a great sample of Tapi Tapi, essentially, from my perspective, or as I understand it, Tapi Tapi is the art of trapping and locking when an object or multiple objects are involved in the technique, as opposed to simply locking and trapping and disarms proper.
     

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