Weapons,Pikiti tirsia influance In Lameco

Discussion in 'Lameco' started by long range, Nov 22, 2006.

  1. gagimilo

    gagimilo Member

    I agree with arnisador, at least that's the way I understood the unfortunate "contest" post. Obviously the person who posted it has not developed too good of a sense for what is the right time and place for certain comments, but I do not think there was any malice.
    It would be too bad to lose such a great and autoritative soure of infromation as Guro Gould certainly is, aspecially to some minor and unimportant attempts at being funny.
    It is exactly the presence of people such as Guro Gould, Guro Agbulos, Mandala Waid...that gives the value and special "wight" forums such as this, since there is not better place to have information from such reliable and trustworthy sources.

    Oh, and no, I'm not trying to suck up to anyone.:)
  2. Gilla

    Gilla -== Banned ==-

    I am sorry if i offend people ,i am not Trolling i was just trying to comment on how many #2 guy's or heirs to the system PTK there are out there. If i had a dime for each one I'd be rich.
    Eddie (just call me Don Imus)
  3. Guro Dave Gould


    Actually guys the comment really hit me as being in very poor taste. Just so you guys know Punong Guro Edgar G. Sulite died on April 10, 1997 so this marks the very day of the 10th year anniversary of his passing (April 10, 2007).

    This is a very sad day for all of us in the Lameco Eskrima organization. So especially now any attempt to make jokes at his expense will get a harsh reaction from any of us who were closest to him in life and death. We just wrapped up a great tribute to him over the week-end filled with high emmotions concerning his life and his death. So if you wonder why I reacted the way that I did now you know.

    Usually I have very thick skin concerning myself but I have never tolerated any disrespect to be shown toward his character and quite honestly I never will. I have two passions in life; Punong Guro Edgar G. Sulite and Lameco Eskrima. Keep in mind guys that we in Lameco S.O.G. defended Punong Guro Sulites character and good name on numerous occasions by fiighting challenges against those that showed blatant disrespect in blemishing his good name in the past. We all will fight to keep his Image pure and his honor in good standing as it should be.

    For the record Edgar never wanted or expected to be the heir to Pekiti-tirsia. It was never promised him by Tuhon Gaje nor did Edgar wish to be considered, he was more than happy with his position with Tuhon Gaje as his student, he revered first and foremost as his teacher and friend. Edgar felt the same toward Tuhon Gaje as I feel toward Edgar and on occasions Edgar did defend Tuhon Gajes name when people were making jokes at Gajes expense concerning his numerous dealing with business associates in the late 70`s and early 80`s.

    I am sure that you are a great guy Eddie, maybe a little forward but your comment was in poor taste. I hope that you realize that and can understand my position on the matter. I feel as well that no malice was intended so we will leave it here as is. Go well guys, ciao.

    Guro Dave Gould.
  4. arnisador

    arnisador Active Member

    I didn't realize it was the tenth anniversary of his passing. What a tribute to him that so many still feel so strongly about him.
  5. sneaky

    sneaky New Member

    Hi Guro Dave et all,

    I for one must say I have always found your dedication to Lameco and PG Sulite most admirable and enspiring, I am not a member of any of the above organisations but am an instructor in FFS , my instructor Ray Floro has always spoken fondly of PG Sulite and of his skill, Its nice to see someone upholding an ideal for only that and not politics.

    All the best and respect to PG Sulites family and memory at this emotional time and all the best to you Guro Dave,

    Jim Seckold,

    Floro fighting systems
  6. RayFloro

    RayFloro New Member

    My thoughts, respect and best wishes to the LAMECO Group and PG Edgar's family through this difficult time.

    Guro Dave, Let me echo Jim's comment and say that you are the BEST custodian for the preservation and propagation of PG Edgar's legacy.

    Keep up the great work


    Raymond Floro
    Floro Fighting Systems
  7. truth_be_told

    truth_be_told -== Banned ==-

    mr. dave gould,

    my present silence in this thread is my way of memorial to PG Edgar Sulite in the past days.

    as they say, One can honor and thanked a cherished relative or friend or mentor with an everlasting gift of love – a memorial.
    This gift lives forever, it is evident by your group yearly memorial tribute.

    please note that i am not associated nor affiliated with your group but owed my grattitude to your founder and international group for my basic foundations.

    silence is golden.
  8. gagimilo

    gagimilo Member

    I'd like adding one more info, just as an illustration of Guro Gould's character. Namely, in his modesty he "forgot" to say that it was him who opened the instructional portion of the LAMECO All Stars event last weekend. In my book it spells honor, and I doubt it was undeserved...

    All the best. I'm so glad we all found the way to overcome this misunserstanding.
  9. Roger Agbulos

    Roger Agbulos New Member

    Hello all! Looks like we got the ball rolling here! This is great!
    My Kapatid Dave, it was great seeing you and the other S.O.G. brothers.. it's been a good 10 years since we last got together. This was a very special event we did for PG Edgar Sulite, sad that there were those who were not able to make it for personal reasons.

    Still, we had a great time honoring him and seeing other FMA brothers support it. What a treat!

    Thank you Dave and my S.O.G. brothers. Glad to see that we are solid in keeping the LAMECO flame alive!

    Roger Agbulos
  10. The true story of Lameco:

    Edgar Sulite was from Ozamis City in Mindanao . I met Edgar through his brother and both of them were in some Karate style. When they knew that I was in the city, they came to me together with my wife's nephew who wanted to study PTK. So I trained them for couple of months timely in preparation for the first Kali Arnis Escrima in Cebu. I trained them along the shoreline of Ozamis in the middle of the hot day and after a while I let them jump into the sea water to cool their nerves. It was a crash program for them. Then I brought them to Cebu to fight in the tournament . They were so aggressive and since I was the referee, I didn't notice that they were my guys fighting against the Cebu escrima, because they were covered by the headgear and body armour, I disqualified both fighters for not following the rules but to my surprised inspite of short training they outpowered the cebu guys that they kept on beating them even I was blowing the whistle. Since the Gym was so crowded with people, I could hardly recognize each one who is fighting. But I was so proud to see that in short a time the PTK boys from Ozamis werre fighting like crazy dogs.

    It was then that I was about to leave for the US that I told Edgar that while he is on development he has to continue in Ozamis there was that old man by the name of GM Caballero. When I visited him in his house he was so frail that he didn't even want to hold the stick. he was so sickly , But I told the old man to teach Edgar because Edgar will bring your his name to the US so that the system will not be lost. So the man turned to be a young and he told his wife to get the Baston and he demonstrated his 1-2 -3 de Campo in full power hitting the banana tree in front of his house. So Edgar had few lessons from GM Caballero and I knew later that he went to Manila and found Tatang Illustrisimo at the Luneta park. He spent time with Tatang Illustisimo and the fact that Edgar had trained with me and mentioning my name to Tatang Illustrisimo he was given attention and with the guys who were with him they had that progress which Edgar had found a Chinese financier for the Book Masters of Arnis. That was the time when I went back to the Philippines several time and Edgar told me the story . So I told him go ahead have that book and I will endorse that book . It also by this time that Edgar saw himself riped for the training and he asked me what name shall I call if I put up a system so I said Long Range-Medium Range and Close Range System in short LAMECO.I was the one that titled that system Lameco.

    So those years that I visited the Philippines in the early 80's I always visited Edgar in his small Apartment in Pasay near the Manila Sanitarium and Hospital and with his three kids I have to help him and his wife . I have to bring Edgar to some places out in the tree area close to Luneta and one to one extended him the PTK knife and knife and stick and ranging techniques.The fact that he was with Tatang Illustrisimo with the style he mixed and form his Lameco. But there were several Masters that Edgar had put in the that Masters of Arnis which the book had made money for him to exist and when Edgar was here in the USA, I told Edgar ,please send some brithday cards or christmas cards to the people that is in the book and put some $ 10.00 for their consulation of they did to you. And he said arrogantly, they can take care of themselves. Well Edgar thinks that he was here in the States he didn't need those old men that helped him succeed. I didn't even remember that Edgar offered me a cap of coffee during the time he was here in the US and even when went back to the Philippines. He knew that was there and he knew where to contact me but he put more time to the Ilustrisimo guys showing them how great was Machado grabbing the punching bag wrestling with it and suddenly he felt dizzy and he was brought to the hospital at Quezon city where he was open in his head and his throat was open for the air to breath. I visited him and his wife was there but he cannot recognize people. I consulted the metaphysical powers and I was told that the oldmen was mad at Edgar for his ingratitude and that is the reason at early age he got knock once and that is the end. As I told every one the true art Kali is a sacred art if you missed with Kali you will be in big trouble.
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2007
  11. viejo

    viejo New Member

  12. Guro Dave Gould


    Tuhon Gaje,

    Wow, I really don`t know how to respond to this. Edgar has always had nothing but nice things to say about you even when others around him were saying terrible things about you concerning some business dealings they had with you in the 80`s... Edgar stood up for you when no one else would.

    So in your eyes Edgar Sulite is another P.Greg Alland? Billy Mcgrath? Nene Tortal? An ignorant boy from the hinterlands who never held a garote until he met you? I am really disappointed to read what you have written here Tuhon, I really am. You have made him sound as if he were nothing more than a poser whose only purpose on the planet was to serve his own selfish ambitions and secure money. That is not the Edgar Sulite that I knew and proudly serve to this day.

    You were one of my first Instructors in the Indigenous Pilipino Warrior Arts and I have always held you in very high esteem Tuhon. I will always be loyal to Edgar Sulite and I will stand by his side even if one day I find myself standing alone.

    Edgar told quite a different version of that story, his time with his father, his time with Manong Caballero, his time with you, his time with Manong Illustrisimo and his time with Manongs Cabahug and Abella. Are you saying that what he told all of his students worldwide are lies? I find that very difficult to believe Tuhon.

    Best Wishes Tuhon I hope that you find what you are looking for, something apparently so valuable that it is worth blemishing one of your most loyal students and proteges image in the process.

    Guro Dave Gould.
  13. sneaky

    sneaky New Member

    A saying springs to mind here,

    "Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than open your mouth and remove all doubt."

    All the best,

  14. Guro Dave Gould


    Hi Guys,

    I hope that all are well and that everyone is keeping challenged by their daily training.

    I just wanted to follow up on Tuhon Leo Gajes post concerning Edgar Sulite. As well I wanted to clarify something which I wrote when I made the comparison as apparently seen through the eyes of Tuhon Gaje between Edgar Sulite, P. Greg Alland, Billy Mcgrath and Nene Tortal. What I wrote was not a slam or anything disrespectful towards these gentlemen in any way. I personally think highly of each one and I feel that each has been utilized when times were good, discharged when times were bad and victimized senselessly and ridiculed there after all because of sharing one common relationship in life... a single past association which doomed them all.

    What I was alluding to when I wrote what I wrote was that at one time all of these individuals were extremely loyal to Tuhon Gaje and once they no longer served his purpose they were disowned, discredited and thrown to the lions left to eat or be eaten. Each trained, propagated and served Tuhon Gajes vision of Kali Pekiti-Tirsia for years and I do not think it fair for Edgar Sulite`s good name and reputation to be dragged through the mud and blemished by the filth of politics for ones own gain. This is all quite unecessary in my opinion.

    If there is merit to these allegations there was plenty of time to make these accusations person to person when Edgar Sulite was still with us in life. 10 years after his death is not the time to come forth and attempt to discredit him for whatever personal gain which may be obtained as a direct course of this poor thought out action. In death he can not defend himself as his own voice has been silenced. And for it to come from some one who he thought the world of is just wrong...

    To say that our Kali fore fathers conspired together in the after life and killed Edgar G. Sulite for his allegated actions and misdealings with his Instructors, too whom he was very loyal by the way is completely preposterous. The TRUTH of the matter is that his killer was an assassin of poverty too whom he was introduced while being forced to grow up in the hinterlands of the Philippines to a loving family with no money to combat a disease better known as High Blood Pressure. Edgar G. Sulite was diagnosed just months before his death with an enlarged heart caused by years of high blood pressure. His heart had simply grown to large for his chest cavity and at the time of diagnosis his condition was inoperable. He became "A" systematic for a stroke and that fateful day in the philippines that is exactly what occured. Because of the severe effects that were created by the stroke Edgar Sulite developed an aneurysm. It bursted and another aneurysm developed which is the one that killed him weeks later.

    Edgar Sulite has always stated that Lameco Eskrima was not his alone and he has always given credit to all of his Instructors for the creation of Lameco Eskrima. I trained under Punong Guro Edgar G. Sulite from 1992 - 1997 when he passed and all of those years I witnesses a very caring, compassionate and loyal man who spoke ill of no man and treated all BELOW him with the utmost RESPECT. You can say what you will of this great man but my personal experience with someone for years forms the basis for my respect for that individual and Edgar G. Sulite was honorable and upstanding and many would do well to establish and follow him as an example in life.

    As one of my first Instructors Tuhon Gaje I respect you immensely but I can not accept these claims allegated against Edgar Sulite. I hope that this is not the beginning of an ongoing series of attacks to discredit him and blemiish his good reputation. He deserves greater than this and I know deep down in your soul that you have to believe this.

    Guro Dave Gould.
  15. langgaw

    langgaw New Member

    .........with all due respect Tuhon, I mean with all due respect, (reading at what you posted) looking as a an onlooker/outsider,THAT WAS NOT A NICE THING TO SAY. I know that your were probably just stating facts but that was uncalled for. That would deminish what respect others have built up towards you. I found it hard to believe you even said that. That would just mean that you are always talking about yourself, your views and what you know about anything else. You should put in some regard for others. I ahve seen most of your posts here and they are quite impressive and htey mostly are about you and PTK and the history behind it. For you to share it here is an honor but I suggest puttng in some finesse and refinements so it can be viewed more as factual,inspirational and informational rather than contriversial, political or otherwise very personal just to boost up your name. You are already an icon and in my opinion you shoul not bring your name down yourself from too much ego. As I said you are already THE ONE in PTK but there is still room for a little humbleness. There is more htan enough going around between you and the names mentioned by Guro Gould and In my opinion there is really no need to add anything else. I can only say that we are still ready for any more infromational posts from you. This is just one of those unfortunate mis-posts and uncalled for facts using the wrong choice of words/ statements. And about the metaphysical, it is like Bruce Lee being punished by the ancient chinese masters for spreading ths secrets of the CMA. Common, we are in teh new age and we know more than that. Ride on Tuhon.

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