Vincent Cabales - True Heir??

Discussion in 'Serrada' started by StixMaster, May 16, 2007.

  1. StixMaster

    StixMaster -== Banned ==-

    Why isn't Serrada practitioners all with GM Vincent Cabales the son of GGM Angel Cabales ? Why is there some many conflicting stories from all sides of this? Shouldn't Vincent Cabales be the heir apparent? I just wonder what will it take to bring unity with all the Serrada eskrimadors ? One can read different versions in various printed material as well as on other forums. It would seem that GGM Angel's son would have taken over for his father thus keeping it together, yet it seems there are splinter groups?? Sup wit that?!
     
  2. Buwaya

    Buwaya Senior Member

    There was a very vocal supporter of Vincent Cabales on another forum some time back, stating much of the same thing while publicly degrading other practitioners. In a PM I asked him

    "was there any documentation from Angel stating that Vincent is the grandmaster and current head of Serrada?",

    "was there any ceremony or ritual passing the down the art with other people present declaring Vincent the new head?",

    "was there anything verbally from Angel stating Vincent as his heir informing all students under Angel that Vincent was the new heir?".

    The awnser to all three of these was "no".

    This is from one of Vincents senior students who had a website insulting other masters of Serrada.

    Some things I'd ask you to look at,
    Who did GM Cabales actually give his school to when he passed away? It wasn't Vincent.

    Who financially supported GM Cabales family after he passed? Again not Vincent.

    Who out of all of Angel's students did Angel's wife consider the best person to send Angel's youngest son to learn the art from? Again, not Vincent.

    All of the Masters and Senior students under Angel are good. But I doubt you'll be able to get them under an umbrella organization. Too many politics, too many years of bad blood.

    Alot of the people who have the awsers to you questions are too humble and forgiving to give upfront awnsers so all you have is info from one side. Though I was raised with Serrada in the home I'm not currently in any camp so I feel more inclined to give a straight awnser.

    BTW, welcome to FMAtalk.
     
  3. StixMaster

    StixMaster -== Banned ==-

    Thanks for the info

    Hey thanks for your input and info. I realize that there is no documentation that gives it to Vincent, thats too bad. I wish them all the best and hope that they can work it all out amongst themselves. Salamat Po
     
  4. darkpaperino

    darkpaperino New Member

    is it really so important to know? I know GM Vincent personally and I know how much he wishes that there would be more unity in the serrada family. maybe in the US it is a bit different - but in Europe no one really cares who is in charge but only what is the picture the serrada family is giving to the public.. and this picture actually is not really the best one in these days!

    keep on training
     
  5. StixMaster

    StixMaster -== Banned ==-

    Something all in FMA should think about!!

    Re: Found this while surfing


    Hey I found this on a groups page while reading FMA digest,sup with GM Davis??? Is he on some kind of ego trip??? Looks like the guy he is talking about just got promoted from a very creditable federation,looks like one of the students of GM Fred Lazo has a difference of opinion. It makes sense that FMA people ought to learn to work together so that a positive legacy can be left, otherwise instead of illegal cock fights, there will be underground death matches to settle dis-agreements. We can all help each other for the sake of the future. Peace out!!

    Both GM Robert Castro ( Eskabo Daan & Kombatan ) and GM Lito Concepcion ( Kombatan) were personally taught and promoted to 9th Dan ( degree) by GGM Ernesto A. Presas. GGM Presas awarded a honorary 9th Dan to GM Emil Bautista ( Kajukenbo - NorCal HQ K.S.D.I. ) who was there at theKombatan training camp as the 'guest of honor'. Eskabo Daan founder GM Robert Castro and Eskabo Daan were also honored to be inducted to the Philipine Martial Arts Hall
    of Fame and Filipino Martial Arts Museum at : [​IMG]








    GGMErnesto A. Presas [​IMG]


    [​IMG][​IMG]10th IPMAF World Arnis Congress and Training Camp , Presas Beach ResortHinigaran
    Negros Island
    Philippines
    [​IMG]
    April 23 – May 7, 2007


    Look I found this on another group while I was checking out the groups directory. Martial artists should really try to get along cause this sets a bad example for all who practice FMA, I practice Balintawak and my GrandMaster Fred Lazo trained from Felicisimo Dizon, the one that GGM Angel Cabales in his book says that he learned from, so technically most of the Filipino styles are all inter-related some how so we should all actually promote each other, something like what is stated in this letter can be forgiven and over looked. All of us who are FMA players should set the standard not tear it all down, however like my teacher told me thats why in the Philipines in the ol' days they fought to the death that way there would be no question of who was good, cause the winner lived and the loser died. Thats why we don't in our school play in tournaments, tournaments develop bad habits. Well that is really a post you found abba.niko. Salamat Po, hey maybe one day they will let outsiders(non-filipinos) excel and grow in their art.

    --- In serradaanthonydavis@yahoogroups.com, "abba.niko" <abba.niko@...> wrote:
    >
    >
    > May 11,2005
    >
    >
    > Greetings Mr.Rob Castro,
    >
    > this letter is in regards to our recent telephone conversation
    > regarding Tony"The Tiger"Lopez,
    > and Jessy Lopez Sr. dating back to May 5,2005. First, I'd like to
    > express that your poor attitude concerning the misuse of both of
    > these very reputable person's names is extremely direspectful and is
    > highly distasteful to all parties concerned. Your unwillingness to
    > support the Tony"The Tiger"Lopez Boxing Seminar on May 14,2005, is a
    > sign of your total disrespect towards this man, and shows that you
    > are not willing to hold yourself accountable for your deceptive,
    > bad, and misleading marketing tactics.
    > How dare you use this man's name in vain over a long period of
    > time, and not feel that you do not owe this man a formal public
    > apology, along with some form of financial reimbursement or
    > compensation as well.
    > Your arrogancy is utterly despicable Mr.Castro. What you have done
    > and continue to do in regards to misrepresenting me, Jessy Lopez
    > Sr., Tony"The Tiger"Lopez, Grandmaster Angel Cabales, Dan Inosanto,
    > Bruce Lee and other's, is totally dishonorable and is extremely
    > unbecoming of a true martial artist.
    > I am personally offended, and I am ashamed to have been your
    > primary martial arts teacher,
    > and for these reasons, I feel strongly, that it is my personal duty
    > to reprimand you in regards to the ambiguous, misleading and false
    > information that you have presented to the world martial arts
    > community. Essentially, what you have been doing Mr.Castro is, you
    > have been releasing untrue or shady information about your martial
    > arts background. What you are doing now, and have been doing, is
    > within the legal world called "Plagiarism". To plagiarise means to:
    > steal and use(the ideas or writings of another) as ones own.
    > There are serious legal consequences that comes along with one who
    > willingly and knowingly plagiarises another person(s) material or
    > ideas. This, Mr. Castro you have most assuredly done.
    > Let me further explain just how you have fallen into the category
    > of being a plagiarist.
    > As we investigate the style of martial arts you claim that you
    > invented known as "ESKABO DAAN" we have encountered some serious
    > flaws or defects. Your creation story about your style of Escrima
    > states the following: Grandmaster Rob Castro's philosophy: E is for
    > Escrima,
    > S is for Serrada from Grandmaster Angel Cabales and Master Anthony
    > Davis, K is for Kali from Master Danny Inosanto, A is for Arnis from
    > Grandmaster Ernesto Presas, B is for Boxing from Champion Tony"The
    > Tiger"Lopez, and Thai Boxing from Master Anthony Davis, and O is for
    > Jeet Kune Do from Bruce Lee. 'Daan' means "The Way" in Tagalog.
    > Now, from my memory recall you've only studied the arts of
    > Escrima and Serrada primarily under one instructor, and that one
    > instructor just happens to be me. Incidentally, Escrima and Serrada
    > are one and the same art form known as(Serrada Escrima) and are not
    > two seperate arts. To my knowledge, you hold no legitimate rank in
    > the art of Serrada Escrima that has been awarded to you directly
    > from the late Grandmaster Angel Cabales. All of your instructor
    > degree's in this particular art comes directly from me. In the
    > contents of your background information, you give people the false
    > impression that you trained directly from GM Angel Cabales, this
    > could not be further from the truth. In reality, your minimal
    > contact with the Grandmaster always came directly by way of me.
    > Concerning your background in the art form of Kali that you claim
    > comes from Danny Inosanto, once again to my knowledge, you have
    > never met nor trained directly from either Dan Inosanto or from any
    > of his main instructor's. As I am the one who personally knows
    > Mr.Inosanto by promoting him in seminars as far back as 1980 & 1983,
    > once more, it is through me that you have acquired any skills in the
    > art of Kali.
    > As far as your claim that you learned your Boxing skills from ex-
    > 3-time World Boxing Champion Tony"The Tiger"Lopez, you and I both
    > know that you have never even met the man, let alone, have you ever
    > personally learned boxing from the man. Out of all of the lies that
    > you have told and documented, thus far, this particular lie is the
    > most appalling of them all. On your website there appears a
    > photograph of myself and one of my now deceased graduate
    > instructor's by the name of Kove Jones. This particular photograph
    > depicts Mr.Jones and myself holding a certificate together; the
    > photo is labled :GM Kove Jones & GM Anthony Davis. Basically, in the
    > photo I am awarding Mr.Jones his well earned Master Diploma Degree.
    > What puzzles me about this photo is, I am Mr.Jones' chief
    > instructor, and Mr.Jones is your senior teacher, but yet, somehow
    > both you and Mr.Jones have now become Grandmasters. Of course
    > Mr.Jones had nothing to do with this fluke, as this particular
    > picture was released just after his untimely and unfortunate death.
    > Lastly, Mr. Castro, you really went overboard when you state that
    > the letter 'O' in your Escrima system stands for "Jeet Kune Do" from
    > Bruce Lee. I' m sure that Bruce Lee's widow Linda Lee Cadwell and
    > Bruce Lee's direct students will dispute this rediculous claim at
    > some given point in time.
    > Your only authentic and brief acquaintance with any of Bruce
    > Lee's original students is with the legendary Prof. Leo T.Fong, whom
    > again you met through me. I have recently informed Prof. Fong about
    > his photo's and information concerning him currently appearing on
    > your website.
    > His response to being informed of this info., is he wants any and
    > all information concerning him to be taken off of your site just as
    > speedily as you removed the information about Tony"The Tiger"Lopez
    > off of your site. Otherwise, he stated, "Mr.Castro will soon be
    > hearing from my attorney". In conclusion of this denunciation letter
    > to you, as of this day { May 11,2005} you are no longer recognized
    > by me or by any member within the body of my organization as one of
    > my graduate Instructor's. As of now, the authority granted to you by
    > me to teach martial arts under the umbrella of my organization known
    > as "MARTIAL ARTS INTERNATIONAL" is now hereby officially defunct. I,
    > Anthony Davis, as the founder and President of "MARTIAL ARTS
    > INTERNATIONAL" do hereby retract and cancel your membership within
    > my association. As of now Mr.Rob Castro, you are no longer
    > officially authorized to represent me in any form or fashion. You no
    > longer have my permission to use the teaching diploma's that I
    > myself gave to you for the purposes of validating your credentials
    > as a teacher within the body of my organization known as "MARTIAL
    > ARTS INTERNATIONAL". Additionally, I am officially requesting that
    > you discontinue the use of my photo's on your website, as I have not
    > now, nor have I ever signed any release forms or waivers stating
    > that you could use any of my materials, images, etc. for the
    > purposes of your promotional campaigns.
    >
    > If you do not abide by any of the demands concerning myself and
    > my products, creations, etc. I, in turn will file a civil lawsuit
    > against you, and we will meet each other again in a court of law.
    >
    > Respectfully,
    >
    >
    > GM Anthony Davis/President
    > MARTIAL ARTS INTERNATIONAL
    >
     
  6. excalibur921

    excalibur921 New Member

    All of this is very interesting indeed. Consider though that Rob Castro did not study for many years with GGM Angel Cabales. That Rob Castro was a student of GM Davis and met GGM Angel Cabales more as a ship passing in the night.

    Additionally, Rob Castro studying under and promoted under GM Davis, not revealing these facts and keeping them under lock and key would be the matter at hand.

    No one would disparage Rob Castro, if he publicly acknowledged the truth of his lineage.

    Regards
     
  7. dennisservaes

    dennisservaes New Member

    Serrada Truths

    I am the Guro you must be referring to. Yes, someone asked those questions, but your understanding of my answers are not correct, so to clear up any misunderstanding, let me clear that up now.

    GM Vincent Cabales Sr. took over the academy before his father passed away, but Vincent was working swingshift so Great Grandmaster asked Master Frank Rillamas and other Masters to help out. However, it was never a question about who would become the next Grandmaster AFTER Great Grandmaster died.

    When Master Jimmy Tacosa got his Master Degree, an incident occured that upset Great Grandmaster Angel Cabales. Jimmy was planning to one day become the Grandmaster and Angel made it clear then that, his son Vincent would take over the system as Grandmaster after he died. Angel was upset.

    Guro Tony Tiexerra and his wife Gwen, were there and witnessed Jimmy Tacosa's girlfriend and Angel and recorded it. Then years later some of the Serrada people at the academy were gathered together and Tony and his wife discribed in detail the event where Jimmy was informed that he would never become Grandmaster that Vincent his son would be the new Grandmaster after he died. The Grandmaster Vincent Cabales Sr. recorded that conversation if anyone has any doubts about that.

    After Angel died don't you imagine he might have some difficulties conducting any ceromonies to announce that his son is now the new Grandmaster?

    Don't be so presumptious! To insinuate that GM didn't or wouldn't help Tess, or teach Jilmar Serrada is a strange thing to say, because I know Vincent. GM would help Angel's family, or teach Jilmar Serrada, but he isn't going to go around boasting to people, something like that. Few people would.


    Train hard and have fun!
    Dennis
    http://www.geocities.com/dennisservaes
     
  8. StixMaster

    StixMaster -== Banned ==-

    Well it looks like in the long run it really doesn't matter because it is all in the past now. He really doesn't have to acknowledge anything. Those that know the truth will just keep it to their self. I read on another forum that after many seminars with GM Davis that GGM Angel used to go to GM Castro's home for the after parties, so I don't think that is ships passing in the night. Furthermore if you knew GGM Angel you would know that he loved to teach his art and if you asked him questions about it he would answer you. What I have heard GM Castro is a real stand-up guy that just wants to promote and advocate all FMA no matter what style it is, because it is all Filipino, isn't it ?? Look at what they did at the 'Gathering' in Vallejo in June. He acknowledges Vincent Cabales as GrandMaster of Serrada. Looks like in the Philippines the Filipinos have acknowledged GM Castro and honored him as Grandmaster isn't that Filipino enough for you?? As for me I will go and meet the man and judge for myself as far as I know and heard he is really a nice man that really knows his stuff, I've seen his graduate instructors move, it was impressive to me. But I don't claim to be an expert but I know great moves when I see them these guys are fast and accurate, especially when they do 'dumog'. Maraming Salamat Po.
     
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2007
  9. pguinto

    pguinto New Member

    all that matters is that everyone passes on their version of the martial arts so that future generations might benefit and do the same. isnt that the filipino tradition? isnt that the heart of the filipino martial arts?

    peace
     
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2007
  10. arnisador

    arnisador Active Member

    I think so--you must make your own way from waht you learn!
     
  11. StixMaster

    StixMaster -== Banned ==-

    My point exactly. One gains knowledge to ultimately pass it on. The knowledge cannot be owned it is shared by the universal mind, available to all who can tap into it. You just have to look into yourself to find the 'key' to unlock the pathway to that knowledge, then remember to ask the right questions.
     
  12. Jramos0531

    Jramos0531 New Member

    It was stuff like this that made me walk away from the art...
     
  13. StixMaster

    StixMaster -== Banned ==-

  14. arnisador

    arnisador Active Member

    It's unavoidable. Office politics sucks too, but we don't quit working! Modern Arnis has it bad as well. I try to keep clear of it as much as possible.
     
  15. StixMaster

    StixMaster -== Banned ==-

    Never let anything get between you and knowledge because once you get the knowledge, its yours and no one can take it away. Politics is part of life, it happens where you work, it happens within families, lodges, clubs, church etc..... So if you walk away, you lose!!! Aloha !!
     
  16. arnisador

    arnisador Active Member

    Yes, good advice! Don't let the politics distract you from getting what you want from the art.
     
  17. StixMaster

    StixMaster -== Banned ==-

    Yes its the knowledge that you want and need, so try to see what teaching that you can tolerate long enough to get the knowledge from. No obstacle should keep you from learning FMA. Keep strong.
     
  18. StixMaster

    StixMaster -== Banned ==-

    1985 ? At Galt Academy for California Corrections. Ray Novencito, GM Davis , GGM Angel Cabales & GM Vincent Cabales & Master Tasi Alo ??? Back in the day
    [​IMG]
     
  19. dennisservaes

    dennisservaes New Member

    My rebuttal was invisible.

    People from the academy want to know where my rebuttal is. It looks rediculous not being able to see my side of it. I would not need to rebuttal if there were not false implications made against myself, the academy and the Grandmaster.
    Thanks
    Dennis
     
  20. Basiyo

    Basiyo New Member

    It's the same reason I took a step back, but I'm sure you'll realize the art is still effective with or without the politics between different groups. Unless you really have no interest in maintaining what you've learned through Serrada, just try to think of it as walking away from the BS, and not the art.
     

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