spirit of warriorism

Discussion in 'General' started by el maldito de cebu, Nov 20, 2008.

  1. SoCalNative

    SoCalNative -== Banned ==-

    My mother's Catholic, bentit. She's Tausug by blood, but she's Catholic by faith. That documentary may be anti-Islam, but what's important is the content it offers. Since El Maldito brought up the subject of Islamic beheadings, I thought he might be interested in the history of this practice. We can discuss for days the history of Islam, its various schools, traditions, and the many interpretations that have sprung from the Qur'an (Shi'a Islam, Sufism, the works of Ibn Taymiyah and Ibn Abd Al-Wahhab, etc. & about how all that are now unfolding in world politics) but that's beyond the scope of this forum (feel free to message me if you want to learn anything about the Middle East or Islam).

    As for the above documentary, it thoroughly explains the history of Islamic beheadings as described in the Qur'an, Al-Sirah Al-Nabawiyyah (the Biography of the Prophet) by Ibn Hesham, the Traditions and Sayings of the Prophet in Sahih Bukhari and Sahih Muslim. You can cross reference all the above work mentioned in the documentary on-line.

    With that said, if you go back to what I wrote, I don't think I said anything wrong about Muslims—just shedding some light about the history and practice of beheadings in Islam (since our friend is crazy about cutting body parts).

    And yes, I do have plenty of Muslim friends (although I have a special affinity towards Wahhabi Islam).

    You might want to check out this work, about the relationship between Islam, Christianity & Judaism as viewed by Saudi Wahhabis:
    http://izzatulillah.wordpress.com/2008/07/25/al-wala-wal-bara

    With Peace.

    Some examples of the Suras from the Qur'an mentioned in the documentary and the above work from Mecca:


    يَا أَيُّهَا الَّذِينَ آمَنُواْ لاَ تَتَّخِذُواْ الْيَهُودَ وَالنَّصَارَى أَوْلِيَاء بَعْضُهُمْ أَوْلِيَاء بَعْضٍ وَمَن يَتَوَلَّهُم مِّنكُمْ فَإِنَّهُ مِنْهُمْ إِنَّ اللّهَ لاَ يَهْدِي الْقَوْمَ الظَّالِمِينَ

    O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people.

    (from the Sura of the Feast 5:51, the Qur’an)


    إِلاَّ الَّذِينَ عَاهَدتُّم مِّنَ الْمُشْرِكِينَ ثُمَّ لَمْ يَنقُصُوكُمْ شَيْئًا وَلَمْ يُظَاهِرُواْ عَلَيْكُمْ أَحَدًا فَأَتِمُّواْ إِلَيْهِمْ عَهْدَهُمْ إِلَى مُدَّتِهِمْ إِنَّ اللّهَ يُحِبُّ الْمُتَّقِينَ

    So when the sacred months have passed away, then slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them captives and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush, then if they repent and keep up prayer and pay the poor-rate, leave their way free to them; surely Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.

    (from the Sura of Repentence 9:4-- Suras 8-9 (Sura 8, being the Sura of the Battle Gains) are said to be one Sura and the last to be revealed.)
     
  2. Robert Klampfer

    Robert Klampfer New Member

    :whatever: Yeah...

    The literal definition is someone engaged or experienced in warfare. Many people use the figurative: "a person who shows or has shown great vigor, courage, or aggressiveness, as in politics or athletics". Personally, I only recognize and use the literal definition.

    What I've seen oversold is the Muslim-Moro-Tausug-warrior spiel. Some (typically young) guy dresses up in pseudo-tribal garb and starts telling tall tales about how many people they've chopped up and eaten. Complete and utter bull****!

    Interesting... I'd like a word-for-word translation of those posts. That way maybe I too could share funny stories about how my friends from places like Camp Lejeune and Fort Bragg go over there and shoot Taliban, Al Qaeda and Abu Sayyaf in the face.

    And the reality is really quite laughable.

    Robert
     
  3. The Phalanx

    The Phalanx FMA's Frank Lucas

    How do you define "pure"???

    I've always thought that Martial Arts should always evolve...

    So you consider someone in the service a puppet of the gov't? You have the NPA mentallity... They think that they are the only ones that matter and the rest of the country are nothing but whitewashed puppets of the gov't... My family and friends of my family who served in the PI military hunted down and killed rebels... They were a threat and as a child seen those threats... Is that where you categorize yourself in??? I have no respect for any rebels in PI who oppose the majority of the people, past, present, and future...

    Unless you have had war experience, you are in no way a warrior... Just someone who is studying warrior arts and probably a descendant of a warrior but you yourself is not a warrior in any way shape or form... I've met and know real warriors... My friends who serves in Iraq and Afghanistan are warriors...

    You need to stop that close-minded mentallity because it's a bigger world out there than you think it is... You want to take your art to the grave, go ahead, nobody is going to care anyways... There are others who more qualified who are willing to share their knowledge...
     
  4. PG Michael B

    PG Michael B Oso Grande

    It seems this topic has grown animosity..perhaps it should be filed under

    [​IMG]

    Lighten up folks, it's the internet. Breath deep and relax...LOL
     
  5. el maldito de cebu

    el maldito de cebu New Member

    aw mao sad ayo2x dra brod. maayo buhi2x lang jd ta ani' aw mao diay stylo ninyo ug magkita ta pohon d ta mga buta share2x nya ta idea nya mag spar ta without gears study sparing ta ba para combative ang technique nya d ta ug sports eskrima combat jd ta kay para reality. naa pd usa dani taga tawi2x daw but puti by heart man pd laban man sa mga puti nya makiglalis pa jd well no comments nalang.
     
  6. The Phalanx

    The Phalanx FMA's Frank Lucas

    Ok, I'm getting irritated with all the Filipino language being thrown all over the place... Most of us here don't speak the language... If you're going to post something that nobody will understand I suggest you two PM each other and not post it publicly... That is an insult towards the rest of us in this website...
     
  7. el maldito de cebu

    el maldito de cebu New Member

    I want to make it clear. 1st of all I'm not claiming that I 'am a warrior I'am not entittled for that name. it is for great and brave men and if I cant kill a person by my bare hands until the day of my deatn I am not a warrior by name. Ya I know Iam young but in the sence of my history I'am not infant I grew up in the environment of history maybe I'am go na be the addition to the missing link you people are arguing with history if had a time I can dig more deeper to the history of eskrima before the bith and developement of it by the 19'century you may be outranked me or older than me but I know more about my history I live in the source the philippines. I had an acces to the national library but the error is time theres a lot of book there that I had read before all about arnis and I cant finish it all in an instance. I know my roots because I reasearch all about it fortunitely before my granparent die to know who I really was. as I speak again and again if the styles had evolve thank its originator and dont compare it because its unique and the master has its tittle and prevelge for it. and this thread is not about religion philippines has already an existing religion long before islam and christain came to the country the anito and bathala was the god of our religion in ancient time. so dont you compare islam and christianity because its different and 2nd dont bran all filipinos as secondary citizens cause we are not all just in the eyes of ignorant people who dont give respect to people. respect is being gained and not asked, do if you want to be respected try not to destroy our image give honor to where you come from. we are all united to this art to have humility discipline and respect and to promote peace so try to act to your accord be modest like the filipino way. the ancient word of anis was never been eskrima or anis for those do not know it is olisi"

    Nagtahod
    el maldito de cebu
     
  8. el maldito de cebu

    el maldito de cebu New Member

    1st of all excuse me and pardon me I am not NPA I hate those people I only served only my family relatives and loved ones. you may never understand me because you dont experience the bad side of the philippines you where here maybe only for vacation and had never looked at the petiful people my people that lived in slumps and the day to day living just to eat one meal. once again to make it clear I'am not branding myself as a warrior I am not worhty for this, the act and the tittle it self but you can never tell ones it is in your blood there are many people who already killed a person but if with out honor you still dont entittled to be a warrior. I am willing to sacrifice myself to my family and loved ones in the time dectates to get the honor. you know what separates a killer from a warrior? its honor and since of dignity. it my own personal choice not to serve in my country as regulars cause I know both the good and bad aspect so why indulge if you know what I mean? and to bring my art until my grave may be it depends, ya many qualified but I strongly advice to look at its quality and ask for advice if its the real deal, i know a lot of eskrima master claiming but faked it if there not fake why not accept there faith do it in the bushido way, you may think its a little not ethical but its already the ethic of our culture ones you obtain the art you must test ones art but I'am not saying to apply this one I only share what is in our way but this not a disrespect I only emphasize what are the wys of the past. I'am not living in the past but I am just looking it back but still just to preserve the culture of course we lived in the modern world and I'am not and idiot I am educated and studied in the university I'am jsut sharing our culture and if you may find it bizzar I appologize it is just in our culture. I may be young but dont belittle people at thier prime. I'am knowledgeable of what I'am capable of but still I am a disciplined person and a respectful one because we are rational we are homo sapiens. if you misunderstood my culture so be it, its a filipino thing and no bodys gona understand it but a fellow filipino brother of mine. I hope I did give you a knowledge and Idea waht is the reality of eskrima. I have just noticed it is already been commercialized and its since of tradiotion is slowly being killed by time so as much as possible keep it real and pure. once again honor and respect the once that empart you this knowlege obey and respect them at all times and dont speak anything ill about it cause you dont know what you are wishing for. I dont know about you but I beleive in bad luck given by karma. ang gaba d magsaba kung kanusa moabot.

    Nagrespeto og Nagtamod
    el maldito de cebu
     
  9. SoCalNative

    SoCalNative -== Banned ==-

    Little Bad Boy,

    You have to stop denigrating 'whites' on here, not one white person has spoken ill of the Filipino culture or of you.

    The issue was simple—people, both 'whites' and Filipinos, oversell this 'warrior' BS. This is a fact.

    This is not a 'whites' vs. Filipinos issue. Whether you're white, brown, or black you are susceptible to this 'warrior' cult mentality. There are various reasons why people gravitate to this, maybe it's low self-esteem or a lack of adventure in one's life.

    But whether you've taken a sip of the Kool-Aid or drank the whole pitcher and asked for seconds, it's there. I would be personally embarrassed participating in this 'we are ancient Filipino Spartan-Samurais of the graphic novel-turned movie 300' pow-wow, the art of fluffing, knowing full well the reality outside of this fantasy land.

    The Filipino martial culture has always been transferred quietly, with no fan fare. The majority of true Eskrimadors walk this path—quiet professionals. They don't have to tell their students that they're the Spartans in '300' or that they are 'the Last Samurais' like Tom Cruise.

    Follow the example of these quiet professionals, not the loud obnoxious 'I'm gonna cut you into little pieces, BBQ your testicles and eat it with some spicy bagoong' types. This isn't Filipino martial culture, this is good old American marketing. I'm sure you already know there are tons of these quiet professionals in Cebu, you'll never see them comin' and more importantly, you'll never hear them brag about cutting hands and putting them in jars for souvenir (a baker, a used office equipment salesman and a former fire-fighter comes to mind, deadly as fuk).

    You know the Philippines is NOT populated by Spartans or Samurais, or Head Hunters. The Philippines is just the Philippines, don't exotify it. Unless you're selling something, there is really no reason for you to prove anything. The art sells itself, you don't need to fluff it up.

    And understand that there are true warriors out there, whether you join their ranks is up to you—but hootin' and hollerin' about it won't necessarily get you there.

    With Peace.
     
  10. Raul

    Raul Mananandata

    Yep! Downright disrespectful! The pure maldito tausug who believes in karma and cannibalizing his enemies and endorses the precepts of bushido and who's wishing to migrate anywhere was unabashedly mocking the Puti (white) in a mostly Puti populated forum (without the Puti knowing it of course).
     
  11. Kali Cowboy

    Kali Cowboy New Member

    Being able to learn something (like your culture) is hard for some people because, first they have to admit what they don't know it. Most of us want to believe, what we have been told in the past, is correct. It is unfortunate but true.

    One of my teachers is a Christian from Negros and the other is a Muslim from Jolo. Both are upstanding men and warriors (use whatever definition you want).

    My teacher from Jolo who is young and full of wisdom, encouraged me to "Go and see for yourself!" Which is exactly what I am going to do.

    God Bless,
    Stephen
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2008
  12. KaliGman

    KaliGman Professional Man at Arms

    Most interesting and best information to come out of this thread. "Soon-to-be baby girl"--congratulations brother! I pity the boyfriends when she becomes a teenager. I can see the "Here, hold this stick while I show you something" deomonstration to the young suitors in my head already!

    Take care,

    Jon
     
  13. el maldito de cebu

    el maldito de cebu New Member

    You just never get it my friend. If you cant understand jsut dont understand it we live in the diferent culture and different environment. jsut dont understand it simple. if you want to really know the tradition of pilipino southerners then maybe a quick relief is to see it by your own eyes and go to our mothers place but dont sleep in the town but go to the barrio to observe what you are looking for. and I'am not being a loud mouth of what I'am. I'am just clearing up things I hope you dont misinterprete this again and if you dont mind did you ever go to school? cause you misinterprete what I was discussing or you have difficulty of reading it. we filipinos maybe branded by you secondary class citizens but at least we have our educations in universities and even if we our poor our education system is always accurate than other 3rd world coutry thats a reason why U.S. is getting our professional teacher and nurses because we are globally competitive so please dont say anything if you dont know nothing. toddler

    Nagtahod
    el maldito de cebu
     
  14. SoCalNative

    SoCalNative -== Banned ==-

    Juramentados

    I visited Bongao many years back with my mother. She was very active in the Church and eventually decided to return to Bongao to do volunteer work. I was in college at that time and was interested in Mindanao, Islam and History. My cousin who’s from there took me around Tawi-Tawi. He was educated at UP Diliman and was somewhat active in the MNLF, so he had plenty of knowledge to share (he did his share of fighting also).

    Tawi-Tawi is just Tawi-Tawi, man. People are poor, but quick to laugh. The children played. And food was great. I slept in a few masjids there. I met AFP officers, MNLF officers, some Muslim clerics educated in Saudi and Egypt, Christian missionaries and Muslim nurses working together. It’s a contested area, so people saw their share of violence. People are people, trying their best to be human in their given situation.

    I met MNLF types that used to be active in the Maranaw area during the Marcos era. They had some war stories, but in the end they were just glad to survive it (this was prior to OEF Philippines). The military and rebels I met were just regular folks. I don’t doubt that they stared into the Abyss, but they’re just trying to be human.

    I didn’t see anyone cutting anyone else’s hand or testicles off for that matter. No one eating any human body parts. Don’t get me wrong it wasn’t Paradise. You get your share of drugs, crime, fights, and family feuds, but this is true for any city or town in the world, whether in the inner city in the US or a developing nation in South America or Africa.

    When you exotify them to be these cannibals, these fierce blood thirsty killing machines, these juramentados, just so you can feel good about yourself being a warrior—being a Filipino Spartan. All you’re doing is misrepresenting them. You are de-humanizing them. There is so much more to Filipino culture.

    You are doing more harm misrepresenting Filipinos like this than you are helping. Don’t get me wrong, there are folks on here that absolutely love the fact that you want to cut people’s hands off and put them in jars for souvenir, because they’ve been conditioned by various stories told here in the U.S. that that’s ‘Filipino culture’. But you should know better.

    You’ve been watching way too much Apocalypto. You’re a city kid, you know that if you went on a crazyjuramentado spree in the middle of Ayala Mall, you’d end up in the Cebu Provincial jail group dancing to the tune of Thriller all day long.

    By all means, train. Just don’t try to fluff all this with BS.

    As for Filipinos, Pakistanis, Malaysians, Indonesians and Africans being second-class citizens in Saudi and the Gulf states, that’s a statement of fact. I’ve been there.

    Arabia’s greatest export is Oil. For the Philippines it’s Filipinos—cheap labor, not warriors. I’m just stating facts, I’m not romanticizing it. We can discuss the Politics or Economics behind this, but that’s the honest truth—Filipinos are cheap labor.


    Here's a good documentary about modern day Juramentados ('those who take the oath'): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5P4Gs3FCLgk
     
  15. PG Michael B

    PG Michael B Oso Grande

    Excellent post SoCal Native....and I concur 100%...mabuhay


    PG Mike B
    BaHad ZuBu KA'LI Ilustrisimo
    Wetsern HQ

    Carabao Clan

    Ipagsama Katotohanan

    PLAN YOUR WORK WORK YOUR PLAN
     
  16. Raul

    Raul Mananandata

    What a post coming from a toddler!
     
  17. The Phalanx

    The Phalanx FMA's Frank Lucas

    There are warriors in this site... Keyboard warriors...

    :redeemer:
     
  18. el maldito de cebu

    el maldito de cebu New Member

    ya your entittled for your own opinion and if thats your truth and speaking of second class arent you filipino by blood first class?
     
  19. FENOM

    FENOM New Member

    I have been keeping my eye on this thread and on some of the threads that you post in or have started and this one really takes the cake. I will respect fact that you have your own opinon and are entitled to it however you have to take a step back and look at the big picture "or you will miss all of the heavenly glory".

    Just because one lives in the motherland of FMA doesn't mean that their understanding/grasp is greater than one who studies or lives in the Western world. nor does it make you an expert in the subject. You are making Filipinos like myself cringe every time I see you post utter BS in this forum.

    I would suggest not getting caught up in the glamour of "warriorism" as you so see it, but rather immerse yourself in beneifts that FMA provides...a sense of family, health, and an art that can bless anyone who are so fortunate train in it.

    One more thing...if you are going to harp on someone regarding their "educations" I suggest that do one or all of the following:
    - you pick up a dictionary
    - use spell check (it's free!)
    - understand the usage of "I'm" (a contraction combining "I" and "am" which is NEVER I'am)
    - use proper grammar
    And this is just to name a few errors in the post that I have seen.
    I myself do not spell with the best of them, but then again, I'm not the one who is looking at "educations".

    Please let me know if you would ever like to borrow my copy of Apocalypse Now. I think one of the characters has a necklace that you might like.
    ~FENOM~
     
  20. el maldito de cebu

    el maldito de cebu New Member

    ya sorry about that and the grammar I cant get my ethnicity. I sometimes scrambled english and filipino spelled words and makes that an error anyway I can never be perfect with english because I can never be american or british because filipino is my native tongue so I hope you understand me. I can never be perfect with my english language specially when all the people living around you is bisaya its not even a national language but instead just a dialect so I hope you did understand. even if I can be wrong with my grammar and spelling but I'am sure my word could be understood isnt' it sir?

    Gumagalng
    El maldito de cebu
     

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