Fencing and Balintawak - Taken from Sabre and Modern Arnis

Discussion in 'Balintawak' started by Rich Parsons, Oct 28, 2005.

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  1. Datu Tim Hartman

    Datu Tim Hartman FMA Talk Founder Supporting Member

    Here is a silly question. Do you find it a bit odd that two prisoners would be practicing weapon fighting in jail? Maybe a couple of stolen moments, but how much training could they have time for?
  2. G22

    G22 -== Banned ==-

    Well its obvious that many people like to either change the historical facts or overlook them if it causes a cognitive dissonance.

    I just dont see where it harms anyone to look into, speculate, heck even assume when it comes to stuff like this. Who is getting hurt by just throwing out "I see fencing influences in Balintawak"? Toss around stories, show links, compare techniques...throw it around and take a look at it. I would think most of the GM's would just say "Huh..thats interesting. Who knows? Could be...Now lets get back to swinging sticks." I dont see where anything really has to be "proven" here. If ya see it ya see it, if ya dont ya dont...BFD. Doesnt change the price of Tea in China...or the Philippines either for that matter.
  3. Rich Parsons

    Rich Parsons Member


    Let me get this straight you are now advocating for the stretching of the truth, for someone to claim something that is not true?

    Very curious
  4. G22

    G22 -== Banned ==-

    The truth? Who is the arbiter of "truth" around here?

    I said:
    What Im asking is "are topics open for discussion here?" All I have seen here is a proposition/opinion brought up and a bunch of people saying "I dont see it" or "PROVE IT!" I havent seen anybody show anything I can accept as "truth" yet. Just a lot of opinions....and people who apparently cant be open minded enough to just play with the idea and even if you dont believe there was a direct influence, at least enjoy discovering a connection to some universal connection to human movement.

    I would fathom to say that Balintawak didnt spring from nothing. There are influences from somewhere in it. Loki seems to see some fencing/boxing in it, why is it verboten to discuss? I havent seen much comparison of technique or philosophy, just a lot of argument. Is it the topic or the presenter thats the problem?
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2005
  5. Cruentus

    Cruentus Tactician

    The problem, Tom, is that the speculation here that Loki is presenting and that you are supporting defies the rules of basic problem solving and logic. If you claim that you believe something is true, then you have to present credable evidence to support your belief or you are being illogical. If you present an idea, the burden of proof is on you, not others to prove a negative or to prove the contrary. Saying things like "speculation is a form of theory," or "because something hasn't been removed from a website, then an entire race of people (Cebuano's) must believe it is true..." (and so on and so on) are nonsensical statements.

    So in and of itself, dealing with stupidity can be fustrating to many of us. The sad part is that behaviors are seldom isolated - so I hope no one is actually relying on you guys to obtain lifesaving information or training, lest the appoach be as well thought out as in this thread.

    Then there is that minor issue that verifiable history happends to be vitally important to a traditional martial art, which Balintawak is. To some of us, it is fustrating that someone would nonsensically try to alter that history that is at the core of our traditional system. It is ignorant at best and dishonest at worst. And to stand by the speculation regardless of all credible arguements why you shouldn't is pure thickheadedness. And yes, dealing with lying or ignorance coupled with thickheadedness can be fustrating for some of us.

    But, this is all just off the top of my head as to why this thread might matter, or might be fustrating to some...

  6. arnisador

    arnisador Active Member

    Admin Note.

    This thread is now closed.

    -FMATalk Admin
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