Empty hand vs knife query

Discussion in 'Kali Ilustrisimo' started by RETIRADA, Aug 23, 2009.


    RETIRADA New Member

    Re: empty hand vs knife

    I would like to ask my fellow Ilustrisimo practitioners...if you only had one drill to do, what 2-person drill would you recommend ? (aside from running)

    A colleague recommended hard core training in knife tapping and all variations...

  2. Raul

    Raul Mananandata

    If I only have one drill to do then I'll choose the Retirada. I'm not a fan of knife tapping so it would be the last on my list. Parry-Block-Strike is basic to KI but its all sword.. all the time.
    Same thing with empty hand against knife.. Retirada principles rule.

    RETIRADA New Member

    Thanks for your feedback Raul, are you still based in Manila ?
  4. Tagis-Talim

    Tagis-Talim Tagis-Talim

    As for me, it would be the drill known as "kisap-mata" or "blink of an eye" in English. This drill is practiced in Bakbakan Kali Ilustrisimo. It is an empty hand drill against knife. Both sides (abierta and cerrada positions) are practiced. It is based on the knife self-defence of Tatang.
  5. Tagis-Talim

    Tagis-Talim Tagis-Talim

    To add an anecdote to my previous posting, years ago when I was a student of Master Rey Galang during one of my private lessons, he showed me the two man drill re: empty hand vs. knife known as "kisap mata" and to prove the effectiveness of the drill, he asked me to attack him with a practice knife. I had many years of training in the martial arts before I came under his tutelage. I wasn't a novice. And so when he told me that he would defend against my knife attacks, I had a smile on my face. And so I attacked him. The attack/sparring wasn't pre-arranged and to my amazement he disarmed me successfully; the knife flew out of my hand! My reaction was disbelief, but after that I became a believer that "kisap-mata" drill which is based on Tatang's knife defence works. The key is, of course, practice, practice and more practice. And as Master Rey did he was willing to put the drill to the test. As we say in Bakbakan, don't stop with the drill, put it to the test.

    RETIRADA New Member

    Thank you for your input. The reason why I posted this query is we are looking for one 'drill' to work on due to constraints of time. All recommendations are appreciated.
  7. PG Michael B

    PG Michael B Oso Grande

    To limit it down to one singe entity is to me a bit precocious. To be able to work in the knife vs empty hand arena one must be well suited in various aspects, running above and beyond all else when the opportunity arises. Having been on the receiving end of a knife attack I can tell you first hand..IT IS MY METHOD of CHOICE. I understand that it isn't always the option thus rendering other motives of operandi a must.

    There is no such thing as compliance on the street so to train haphazardouly in duel mode is as useful as the mumps. The duel is a theory driven scenario manifested by those in the game who truly believe in the epic martial battle. It doesn't go down like that! If it did come to the duel then another question would have to be asked "WHY ARE YOU DUELING"? I guarantee know matter how much you know, how much you think you know and how much hutzpah you have your still gonna get bit. Those who say no have never been in the eye so it is easier for them to persuade others as to their prowess..

    Put live steel in your hand, the element of surprise , and intent and I guarantee you the same mindset would not evolve.

    So what to work on? Everything...have a student mad dog bum rush you with no telegraphing using a hard wooden dowl or a hard steel trainer (when you get popped you will damn sure know it)...make it more than one attack (prison style..stab stab stab stab)...have them go at it on the ground to regain the blade and the footing....off of the wall.....in the car...everywhere..multiple scenarios etc. no training gear outside of goggles (maybe)....have it roll at a building pace....at the end of the day it shoud be full blown attacks with intent and malice...in this scenario training you will find truth....not the entire truth but enough to get you going if it ever goes south..only in real life and death combat will you ever know if it is plausable....even with this training or any training your chances of getting cut are excellent if you choose to stay and play.

    "I will run for the hills...and see you another day ;)....guaranteed...then when the bang stick goes boom it makes it all a moot point! Because you will never see it....back of the head lads..back of the head"
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2009
  8. Raul

    Raul Mananandata

    I'm now based in the states but I go to Manila every chance I can get.
  9. Raul

    Raul Mananandata

    It would be nice to see that drill in action, or at least on video.
  10. Tagis-Talim

    Tagis-Talim Tagis-Talim

    I'll see what I can dig up, Raul. The story I shared happened circa 1990's. When I trained with Master Rey back then I usually filmed the sessions with him so I could look at it and review the lessons.

    Please give me time. I have to go through my VHS tapes and try to locate it. If it would help in any way, I don't mind sharing it with my Kali Ilustrisimo brothers. I also am interested in seeing drills you guys use or practice. My question though is how do we facilitate the exchange of materials?
  11. gagimilo

    gagimilo Member

    Well, the first thing that comes to mind is - youtube!
    Of course, if you'd prefer limiting the availability to only certain people, you can sigh up with martialmatrix.com and only share your videos with your friends on the site, or someting like that. Also, there is this service called transferbigfiles.com which you can use to share the stuff individualy, with a person of your choice.
  12. Bahad Zubu-Florida

    Bahad Zubu-Florida New Member

    i believe youtube gives you an option to have uploaded video to be seen only by individuals of your choice--up to 25, i think...
  13. Tagis-Talim

    Tagis-Talim Tagis-Talim

    Thanks for the idea. But how do I transfer films from VHS to YouTube? I simply don't know. Most of the films I had were preserved in VHS tapes.
  14. Brian R. VanCise

    Brian R. VanCise Senior Member Supporting Member

    You will need to have them converted first from vhs. [​IMG]
  15. arnisador

    arnisador Active Member

    That could be an aggravation!
  16. Brian R. VanCise

    Brian R. VanCise Senior Member Supporting Member

    I know a few people that do this by going to Rite Aid. So it is not
    that bad.

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